The habit of disrespect, rudeness, and sass in this house HAS GOT to stop.

[Beth1231]

Reading along.
I am getting the turning away/huffy tone lately as well.
I really try to reflect what I see. "Your body language is saying you are frustrated. I am here to listen,please turn towards me again and let me know how you feel." And usually,she turns back to me and tells me in an agitated voice her frustrations and how she feels. And I reflect,repeat what she's saying and inch my way toward "I have heard you,your thoughts and words matter to me. We are doing xyz now." So I try to communicate that she can express her feelings but I am still her mother and in most cases,will still make the final call and I expect her to comply.
And she isn't thrilled but we talk about privileges and responsibility that comes with getting older and that helps her some. We also talk about being thoughtful of other people. Sometimes I am just honest and tell her,"I feel frustrated and unheard when you turn away from me and cross your arms."
She is practicing on me and her dad because she feels safe with us,but it's wearying.
I hope her furture husband appreciates it.

[ChristmasGirl]

Could it also be possible that the culture you are living in now is a lot more into manners and respect and that you are viewing things differently? Different social expectations?

[mamajane]

Originally Posted by NovelMama

And now she's too revved up to be kind with her tone, so no matter how often I make her try again she's not going to do it. She's going to get more and more angry if I keep scripting and making her try again, and eventually she'll just start crying. I know there are phases where I've seen some of you say to ignore the tone and focus on the words, but 9 is way too old for that, isn't it? The tone is kind of the whole point here. She obviously is able to choose kind and respectful tones with other people, so she should choose those tones with us as well.

And that conversation could have been written between PJ and me as well, though with an emotionally young 6.75 I'm more inclined to accept the tone and focus on the words, BUT, again, she is an angel with everyone else so choosing the right tone *is* possible for her - she simply doesn't make that choice with us.

IRT being an angel for everyone else, could there be an aspect of this which is that you are a safe person with whom she can let her frustration come out through her tone?

[3PeasInAPod]

Originally Posted by NovelMama

The scripts help them with the words, but not with the tone. Example:

Me: AJ, time to clean up.
AJ: What!??! Nooooo!!! You said five minutes!
Me: I know, and it's been five minutes. Try, "Okay, Mom."
AJ: But Mooooom!
Me: Try, "Okay, Mom."
AJ: *Huff and cross arms and turn away.*
Me: Try, "Okay, Mom."
AJ: *snotty tone* Okay, Mom.
Me: In a kinder tone, please. "Okay, Mom."
AJ: *monotone yelling* OKAYMOM.

And now she's too revved up to be kind with her tone, so no matter how often I make her try again she's not going to do it. She's going to get more and more angry if I keep scripting and making her try again, and eventually she'll just start crying. I know there are phases where I've seen some of you say to ignore the tone and focus on the words, but 9 is way too old for that, isn't it? The tone is kind of the whole point here. She obviously is able to choose kind and respectful tones with other people, so she should choose those tones with us as well.

And that conversation could have been written between PJ and me as well, though with an emotionally young 6.75 I'm more inclined to accept the tone and focus on the words, BUT, again, she is an angel with everyone else so choosing the right tone *is* possible for her - she simply doesn't make that choice with us.

I don't go back and forth like that that many times. I script "yes mom" and move on. .and it may not be a "logical" consequence but if my 9th old is disrespectful to me it's usually bc he's busy playing with something (let's say legos) so he doesnt get to play with them for a period of time (even if it's an hour). I still model and teach him, script him. Etc but he doesn't get to disrespect and just keep the privilege of playing with a certain toy.

[jandjmommy]

Originally Posted by NovelMama

I'm truly appalled at the way my daughters talk to my husband and me - though in reality I bear the brunt of it. I really don't know what we've done wrong to allow this behavior to flourish. I NEVER would have talked to my parents the way my girls talk to us. Granted, DH and I were raised in punitive homes, but even without the threat of spankings hanging over me I wouldn't have talked that way to them!

PJ is 6.75. AJ is 9 a week from today. AJ is far worse than PJ is, and if 9 is worse than 8, then I seriously just want to run away from home this year. She huffs and turns her back to us when we correct her. She sneaks around and does things we've specifically told her not to do, then lies about it when we confront her. She simply doesn't do things we've asked her to do. PJ sasses like nobody's business. Where she learned to talk to people that way, I have no idea. Both of them throw fits when they don't get their way, and when I say "don't get their way" I mean things like not being allowed to bring their bedtime snack upstairs or having to stop playing so they can come eat dinner. (And yes, I give them transition warnings so they know it's coming.) Both of them argue and whine and debate and ask, "but pleeeeease?" and/or "but whyyyyy?!?!?!" over and over and over and over whenever they've been told no to something. (And yes, I explain the reasons behind my rules/directions, but that doesn't stop them from pushing back.)

And what really kills me is that the *first* thing people say to me after interacting with the girls for any length of time is, "Your girls are so kind/considerate/respectful!" Every. single. time. I'm relieved they're not like this with other people, but WHY in the WORLD are they like this with us?!

I just don't know what to do. I have no idea what the root of this is, and I can't figure out what a logical consequence would be. Having them rephrase or ask again nicely or whatever just amps them up and makes them more angry, and then the whole thing gets escalated way out of hand, particularly for PJ, though AJ goes pretty nuts in her own way after a while. I'm just SO TIRED of it.

I have not read the other replies. My kids act like this when they are not helping out around the house enough. When they are doing real work each day to help keep the household going, their brains settle.

Case in point: Christmas Eve through the day after Christmas. I thought I was giving them a treat by not having them do chores, but they went stark raving mad. I finally separated them and ordered them off to do several things to help out...15 minutes later the house looked a whole lot better and the kids were calm for the first time in 3 days.

No rewards for doing chores here, and no punishments for not doing them, but nothing else happens until the jobs they have chosen or have been assigned are done.

I started doing this after I finally got the message of the book Positive Discipline through my thick skull: our primary need is to belong.

Contributing to the good of the family equals belonging, and makes everyone (including me!) much, much less sassy and disrespectful.

[Tracy]

Wow! I could have written that scenario with my 9yo daughter. Came here to find guidance. Thank you all.

What do you do about the melt downs, the slamming doors and if she continues to yell at you after you've said I'm not going to listen until you respect/talk to me nicely

[Mother of Sons]

It's hard but I didn't do anything. Power struggles only happen when both people tug on the rope. My kids tried telling at me, following me around etc. I just ignored and went about my business, occasionally repeating my phrase. It got boring to hear. They WILL get worse to see how far you are going to take it. Don't lose your cool. Eventually they get it. Make sure to have the discussion in advance. You can also validate. "I can see that you are angry. When you are calm we can talk" or "I see that you are disappointed, are you ready to tell me about it respectfully? Try to keep it positive. Instead of "I'm not going to listen until..." Try "I will listen when..."

[Tracy]

Thank You!

[Soliloquy]

With my oldest, I really vented it out with her. I told her how disrespected I felt. I told her how I rarely did anything for myself but spent so much time, energy and money on things for the kids/family. I told her that, at that moment, I didn't even like being her mom because I was being treated like a maid.

She really listened and completely changed.

My other child that had a problem with this--it took a bit longer and we're still working on it but progress has been made.