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Unprepared for Parenting (Ezzos, Pearls, Etc.) *Public* Support and information for those affected by the Ezzos, the Pearls, and other punitive and adversarial methods of child-rearing.
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23. No posts harshly dissecting parenting moments of others since we desire to humbly cultivate a heart attitude of grace and not judgment towards other mamas. We all struggle at times as parents and have much to learn, and GCM's focus is to provide tools and information for each of us to parent more effectively. Posts voicing some frustration regarding choices made by others can be okay, but it needs to be within the overall context of seeking understanding or ideas for better responses in the future.

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Old 03-12-2012, 05:26 PM   #31
ThreeKids
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

When I first saw the title Babywise, I thought it meant, "I got your number, Baby. I'm wise to you."
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Old 03-12-2012, 06:04 PM   #32
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

If you reengage try this: "Posting statements from the American Academy of Pediatrics is not an opinion piece, but a statement by professional. If I had wanted to express my opinion on the issue I would have posted Ezzo.info instead."
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Old 03-12-2012, 08:59 PM   #33
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loralee View Post
I mean, it does have the words "wise" and "baby" in it and so does the Bible. Must be biblical.
And Ezzo is a pastor, so his advice must be biblical. At least that's what I was told (by someone who honestly believed it).
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Old 03-12-2012, 09:06 PM   #34
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

Does the "excommunicated from at least two churches" not help to sway that opinion?
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:56 PM   #35
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

Whenever I've had people tell me that their babies did fine on a schedule, I replied that that's great, and that some babies can make that adjustment, but schedule-feeding is an ADAPTATION; God designed us to nurse on demand. If anyone studies the physiology of how breastfeeding works, he or she cannot deny that nursing frequently is how we are DESIGNED to give and receive milk as babies. And I have said that the problem is that not all babies and mothers (even most, perhaps) cannot make that adaptation, so it's dangerous to suggest it to people. It can lead to low milk supply or even lactation failure.

But of course, if anyone believes that schedule feeding can be extrapolated from the Bible, you have much bigger hermeneutical issues to disagree over...
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Old 03-13-2012, 03:31 PM   #36
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiara.I View Post
Does the "excommunicated from at least two churches" not help to sway that opinion?
If I'd known it at the time, I definitely would have challenged her definition of "pastor".
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Old 03-13-2012, 03:49 PM   #37
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

From the nitpicker of all things Ezzo: he was actually "only" officially excommunicated from one church, he left two other churches under a cloud. The pastor of one of those other two churches said publicly that they had the same sorts of issues as were documented in the excommunication statement, and that he considered Gary to be unfit for public ministry.

When I think of how many people never leave a church under any sort of cloud much less get to the point of excommunication, it is sort of astonishing to imagine someone could be so unlucky or misunderstood that THREE churches have felt this way about him.

The other thing about the "pastor" credentials is that Ezzo's pastoring experience comes from the church where the senior pastor (who knows the Ezzos very well) said he considered Gary to be unfit for public ministry.

Last edited by katiekind; 03-13-2012 at 03:56 PM.
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Old 03-13-2012, 04:17 PM   #38
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

I'm sorry. That's frustrating. I have never found it worthwhile to try to discuss anything with devout Ezzo followers. There are no logical discussions - it's just crazy-making talk. I had one couple (who teach the class at a church) arguing that the quotes I was giving them from an early (1985) edition of the book were just made up, and that the book didn't actually say that. I considered making copies and faxing it to them, but I was already so done with the conversation at that point that I just walked away from it. I don't have hours on end to argue nonsense.

Since then, I just won't engage unless I feel like the person is genuinely interested in hearing another perspective and discovering truth. I think a "I'm sorry you're offended, but I feel like this is something that needs to be said" is completely sufficient. That's what speaking the truth in love is all about, IMO. It doesn't mean the other person has to like what you're saying.
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Old 03-13-2012, 05:29 PM   #39
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

I'm another one for FB drama.... I post stuff ALL THE TIME that people get all upset over. What can I say, I like the debate! I only post the REALLY controversial stuff, like circ, vaccines, breastfeeding... y'know
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Old 03-13-2012, 06:52 PM   #40
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gentletitus2mama View Post
I tried to tell my story about my experience and then just leave it to agree to disagree but instead they are replying that obviously my problems with it were due to other things not Babywise and oh by the way, watch out for that research cause it's probably not biblical. Ummm, oooookay. I don't think it would even be productive to answer back. One of my other friends though did reply and add some good imput so that was helpful. It may or may not drive me crazy when I have done years of research on a topic only to be dismissed as someone who doesn't know what they are talking about.... I suppose that's prideful but argh..lol *deep breath* One of my research papers I worked on to submit to my teacher she suggested I expand it into a book. I talked about how the treatment of the youngest members of a society reflects on the society in general and how we've come to where we are as an American society... anyway.
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Old 03-13-2012, 06:54 PM   #41
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

And you can also block them from that post.
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Old 03-13-2012, 07:56 PM   #42
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

My heart goes out to you. I am SO non-confrontational. I remember teaching a Sunday School class to the 8-10 year olds one week, where the "lesson" was "stand up for what's right." I was quite convicted about that--here I was telling 8 year olds to do something that I frequently fail at.

Anyways, you had your "stand up for what's right" moment.

I'm sure you were tactful and appropriate. Your church friends will get over it, and after the bluster, maybe they'll think.

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Old 03-13-2012, 08:14 PM   #43
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loralee View Post
I mean, it does have the words "wise" and "baby" in it and so does the Bible. Must be biblical.
If I understand it correctly, Babywise is the "secular" version of their book. There's also a "Christian version" complete with workshops and such to be taught at the church, called Growing Kids God's Way, and from what I've heard (I haven't ever read/seen GKGW, I did get Babywise out of the library before I got pregnant, mainly because I KNEW I had several acquaintances who swore by it and I wanted to be able to honestly say "thanks for the suggestion, I've read it, it's not a good fit for our family") that book/series very much implies, if not outright says that this the one and only way to raise children and be in obedience to God. So yes, someone who had bought into GKGW would feel that it was biblical and anything that contradicted it was unbiblical.
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Old 03-13-2012, 08:25 PM   #44
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetpeas View Post
that book/series very much implies, if not outright says that this the one and only way to raise children and be in obedience to God.
I haven't read the series GKGW, only the title, and I got that much just from the title.
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And my kids were going to behave perfectly all the time and if they didn't, they'd be Dobsoned, but I was going to Dobson so perfectly that they'd know not to slip up but once or twice because I was going to be sooooooo consistent and awesome and wise.
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Old 03-13-2012, 08:25 PM   #45
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Default Re: Hate to cause conflict with my church ladies.

Babywise is the secular version. GKGW is for older children, though. The baby version used to be called Preparation for Parenting, but then they changed the name. Last I heard it was "Along the Infant Way" or something like that.
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