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Old 07-24-2012, 09:16 AM   #1
Pearl In Oyster
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Default "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

My pediatrician gave me a copy of The American Academy of Pediatrics' "Your Baby's First Year." At the back of the book is a section on sleep, with this paragraph as part of its conclusion.

Quote:
Many adults are chronically poor sleepers because of patterns that often began during their own childhood and continued on. Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior, and when a baby doesn't get quality sleep, he may not learn how to sleep well. In many cases, such sleep issues are likely to become part of his life for many years.
So, is this true or just a scare tactic?


Thinking aloud through my own experiences...

C has never been a "good" sleeper. She is spirited, and that expresses itself in the area of sleep with sensitivity -- the slightest stimuli can keep her awake and she's easily awakened -- and irregularity. No matter how I tried to encourage a predictable "sleep schedule" or even a rhythm, it didn't work and stressed me out. When I followed her cues, her sleep times varied widely, but she mostly got the "right" total amount of sleep.

Today, she still wakes up 2 - 3 times per night, but added together her total sleep is enough, if on the lower end of the "healthy" range. Her bedtime still varies by 90 minutes or so.

Z seems to be naturally a little more predictable already with his sleep.

So, in this small anecdotal sample, it doesn't seem to be "learned"
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:03 AM   #2
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

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Old 07-25-2012, 10:15 AM   #3
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

Completly disagree with this. Craziness.
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:17 AM   #4
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

Well. Take a quick mental inventory of cultures around the world.

Lots of them, especially the still-tribal small area cultures co-sleep, nurse on demand. They also have adults. How do those adults sleep? Are they chronically poor sleepers who are tired and stressed out all the time? Um...not usually. They tend to be pretty content and well-rested compared to North Americans. Verdict is? Bunk.
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:22 AM   #5
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

Also, I'm sure I read somewhere recently, that gifted children need less sleep than normal intelligence range children... but goodness knows WHERE I read it...

Sleep studies show that every human being wakes up on average TWENTY THREE times per night. Most of those night wakings we forget b/c we go straight back to sleep.

I really can't see how 'sleeping poorly' or for that matter 'sleeping well' is a learned behaviour, seeing that sleep is an involuntary process. Try staying awake if you're dead tired. Similarly, try going to sleep when you're not. No dice
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:28 AM   #6
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

Yes, I think sleeping poorly is a learned behavior. After I had kids, I learned to sleep poorly. Very quickly, I might add. It might take years to unlearn.
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Old 07-25-2012, 12:23 PM   #7
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

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Old 07-25-2012, 12:39 PM   #8
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

my dd had an undx'ed gluten issue...she slept *EXCRUCIATINGLY* poorly for 5 years. She's gf now and sleeps better. My two boys sleep like the dead and have periods where they have hard spots of sleeping.

I DO believe that if you leave children to cry it out they begin to associate sleep with bad things and it can last until adult-hood
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:19 PM   #9
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

It seems like it goes both ways. There are sleep issues that are taught and not taught. Parents can teach kids that sleep is scary and lonely or pleasant and safe. Kids can have nightmares and get thirsty and pee at night and all that, and some kids are groovy to sleep easily. Nature and nurture are both playing in this area.

I hate that any sleep issues are considered a parental failing. Particularly the sleep issues that don't bother the family but are inconvenient for other people, like a child nursing at night or needing to nap at a certain time. Just because you can't put your baby away when you are done for the day...
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:33 PM   #10
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

I think that is true in some cases, not all.
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:37 PM   #11
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

When bedtime and sleep are used as a punishment, children really can learn to fear bedtime.
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:41 PM   #12
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

I have heard as well that gifted children need less sleep... I believe its true. I have slept in 2 yrs but my dd is so smart and ahead on every chart... Lucky me lol
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:00 PM   #13
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

Yes and no.

Maybe I'm going to take this on a tangent that you didn't really intend....

The quote you listed:
Quote:
Many adults are chronically poor sleepers because of patterns that often began during their own childhood and continued on. Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior, and when a baby doesn't get quality sleep, he may not learn how to sleep well. In many cases, such sleep issues are likely to become part of his life for many years.
The bolded part, I *do* agree with. Do I necessarily think this starts with a baby (under 1 year)? No.

But, there are lots of statistics that show Americans in general are a very much sleep deprived nation AND have very poor sleep "habits". And I think many of them are "learned behaviors" in that parents are making choices for, and modeling, very poor sleep habits. IMO, things like using TV to put children (or adults ) to sleep, too much light in a room(which interrupts the natural melatonin your body produces), and lots of other things are, in a way, "learned behaviors" and are contibuting factors to poorer sleep quality.

Did I get too far off topic?
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Old 07-25-2012, 03:04 PM   #14
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

I don't know about needing to learn to sleep as a "baby" but I agree that sleep issues start in childhood. I think it is more of an issue of learning to appropriately handle stress. We are a stressed nation and stress leads to sleep issues and all sorts of health issues. I don't think many people will argue that our childhoods influence how we learn to take care of our bodies.
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Old 07-25-2012, 03:13 PM   #15
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Default Re: "Sleeping poorly is a learned behavior"?

Quote:
Originally Posted by backtobasicsmum View Post
Yes and no.

Maybe I'm going to take this on a tangent that you didn't really intend....

The quote you listed:


The bolded part, I *do* agree with. Do I necessarily think this starts with a baby (under 1 year)? No.

But, there are lots of statistics that show Americans in general are a very much sleep deprived nation AND have very poor sleep "habits". And I think many of them are "learned behaviors" in that parents are making choices for, and modeling, very poor sleep habits. IMO, things like using TV to put children (or adults ) to sleep, too much light in a room(which interrupts the natural melatonin your body produces), and lots of other things are, in a way, "learned behaviors" and are contibuting factors to poorer sleep quality.

Did I get too far off topic?
I think it's relevant, and I agree with you Karisa. More discussion of what "learned behaviors" are truly important to avoid and which ones are just for convenience of others as MegMarch alluded to would be great.

I think most would agree that watching TV to go to sleep can be a short term solution but is not really a good habit.

Here's one I'd like to discuss more: The AAP sleep discussion indicated that except for rare exceptions, allowing/expecting a baby to fall asleep in locations other than the crib (for example, while running errands or at a restaurant with the family b/c excessive stimulation might keep them awake past naptime) would contribute to a baby learning to sleep poorly.

Now we all know babies don't have to sleep in cribs, but putting that aside, how important is it to be home at naptime?
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