No waffle, no "coffee"

Dtswife · 07-01-2014, 08:15 AM

Is requiring a two and a half year old to eat a toaster waffle that she BEGGED for and NEEDED with CREAM CHEESE!!! before she has her "coffee" (milk with a touch of strawberry syrup) unreasonable? She's very verbal; she understands what the if/then process is.

saturnfire16 · 07-01-2014, 08:22 AM

Being very verbal is not the same as the logic required to understand if/then. I've had 3 very verbal 2 year olds, and I know it's really hard not to think of them as older than they are.

Setting up food battles is a way to set them up with issues around food for life. I wouldn't make her eat it. She might truly not be hungry. Or maybe what she thought sounded appealing in the moment, doesn't look so good now that she sees it. Adults have that happen too.

Dtswife · 07-01-2014, 08:29 AM

I'm not going to make her eat it, but I don't think I'm going to make the drink either. She doesn't want any food, so while the milk with strawberry wood be ok if she had the cream cheese in her tummy to slow down the sugar, she'll be a crazy person......

I want to be the fun auntie, but she's with me and mom so much, I feel like I have to be a parent figure.

Hermana Linda · 07-01-2014, 08:51 AM

That's a good reason not to make the drink. She could have the milk alone or maybe she will want the waffle later.

Sent from my mobile device by Tapatalk

Little Forest · 07-01-2014, 09:24 AM

Maybe she is thirsty, or more thirsty than hungry?

I don't understand why she could have the waffle and drink but not just the drink or the drink before the waffle.

Mind you, I would not make the milk too sugary at any rate. The protein and fat in the milk slow down the sugar absorption in the bloodstream too.

Do her parents have any such policy on her eating and drinking?
Posted via Mobile Device

Dtswife · 07-01-2014, 10:58 AM

Because the drink is special and she isn't allowed to have it all the time or before she has food of some kind. Yogurt, waffle, whatever, food before special drink.

She has water available to her all the time in a sippy cup.

I don't know what my sister's policy is. We don't really hang out together that much.

She ended up eating the waffle.

ArmsOfLove · 07-01-2014, 11:08 AM

I think there are two issues - do you give her the milk/"coffee" AND should she be able to understand.

As to the first - totally your call and I think whatever you decide to do is fine

If you decide to give it to her it's fine

If you decide not to, it might give you a chance to reflect feelings and help her learn to name and own her feelings, or she might be fine and that's great too

As to the second, she is too young to be expected to really understand, but it can be good to share your reasons very simply and matter of factly.

Instead of choices I did a lot of "first X, then Y." So like "you can have your drink after you eat your waffle. Eat your waffle." (I consider these great opportunities to speak with words of logic so that as they develop pre-logic and then logic they start to understand what you've been doing and they already have the language

)

Dtswife · 07-01-2014, 11:25 AM

We did that. When your waffle is gone, I will make your coffee. . . Waffle, then coffee...... when your tummy is full of waffle, you can have pink coffee...... all interspersed by "NO! COFFEE NOW!"
Followed by me: "I know. Pink coffee is so yummy. But waffle first."

Johns_Gal · 07-01-2014, 11:44 AM

When I do offer treats, my quota for nourishing food has already been met so I don't fret. Like eh, you ate an avocado and chicken... sure, you can have a sorbet. At that age though, no treats with qualifiers. Either the kid can have it right then or I don't even mention it.

If she was accustomed to it, I would just do it and move on. Not my kid, not my problem.

I'm not his/her parent and if that's how her family does it, I'm not going to change it up on a 2.5 year old.

ArmsOfLove · 07-01-2014, 11:44 AM

gotta love the wee ones contribution to those discussions

I often had to remind myself that the best way to deal with them in those moments are the way I would deal with a drunk adult - can't reason with them, can't expect them to have logic, just tell them what we're doing and insist they do it (for example, pry keys out of their hand and stuff them into the backseat

).

Glad she ate the waffle

sounds like you handled it great

Johns_Gal · 07-01-2014, 11:49 AM

Drunk adult. That is the most horribly perfect analogy for a cranky toddler.

Just be quiet and here's a deceptively nourishing muffin. We're leaving. Where are mama's earplugs?

Dtswife · 07-01-2014, 11:52 AM

She may not be my child, but I love her very much and when she is here, she is my problem and responsibility.
It wasn't offered. She asked.

I don't know for sure what her family does. I know brother-in-law doesn't care and gives her snickers for breakfast sometimes. Idk what my sister's at home policy is.

She's here at the store 3 days a week. This is more like being at home for her than a fun visit to Grandma and aunt Chelse.

I use her as a GBD test pilot.

Lol, drunk person is a great description! Love it!

ArmsOfLove · 07-01-2014, 12:13 PM

Sounds like she responds really well to your boundaries and I bet she feels really safe when she's with you

One of the things I love about gentle discipline is the opportunity to give the children who are in my life - even those not mine - tools they can use to navigate the rest of their world. If I share with a child the idea of taking a break, or even just reflect and name their feelings, that is something that they can remember when they are back in their every day and something happens. It can show them there is another way than what they usually experience (whatever that is). I think it's empowering for them

rjy9343 · 07-02-2014, 07:12 AM

You are in a strange position. You aren't quite the aunt, but not the quite the parent either. I am in that place with my niece and nephew. It is a very hard line to walk, but it does pay off in spades. My niece is nine and my nephew is eight, both children trust me and like to be around me. They believe me to be safe person and have chosen to let me be a part of their lives because I did a lot of what you are doing now.
Verbal does not mean understanding. My daughter spoke in complete sentences before her second birthday, but that did not mean she grasped what she said. It was really frustrating because she sounded and reasoned like a five year old, but had the emotional maturity of a two year old. It is still irritating at times to treat her like she is her age because she sounds like she is in elementary school when she speaks. The child has not even reached kindergarten.

OatsandBran11 · 07-02-2014, 10:07 AM

Have you been around her pretty consistently when she was born? Other people's 2-year-olds always seemed older to me, but now that I have my own, I am more aware of her limitations.

07-01-2014, 08:15 AM	#1
Dtswife Rose Bouquet Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wisconsin USA Posts: 814	No waffle, no "coffee" Is requiring a two and a half year old to eat a toaster waffle that she BEGGED for and NEEDED with CREAM CHEESE!!! before she has her "coffee" (milk with a touch of strawberry syrup) unreasonable? She's very verbal; she understands what the if/then process is. __________________ Married since May 2010 to DT Mama to Zoe 8/1/13 Baby number two due May 17th 2015

07-01-2014, 08:22 AM	#2
saturnfire16 Rose Garden Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: North Eastern CA Posts: 9,119	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" Being very verbal is not the same as the logic required to understand if/then. I've had 3 very verbal 2 year olds, and I know it's really hard not to think of them as older than they are. Setting up food battles is a way to set them up with issues around food for life. I wouldn't make her eat it. She might truly not be hungry. Or maybe what she thought sounded appealing in the moment, doesn't look so good now that she sees it. Adults have that happen too. __________________ ~Emily INTJ, Type 4 Wife to D Mama to: E 12/05 L 7/08 Z 12/10 A 6/14 and J in heaven 2/10 Torah Keeping, Unschooling Family My blog on unschooling and family life: Peace On Dark Nights.

07-01-2014, 08:29 AM	#3
Dtswife Rose Bouquet Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wisconsin USA Posts: 814	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" I'm not going to make her eat it, but I don't think I'm going to make the drink either. She doesn't want any food, so while the milk with strawberry wood be ok if she had the cream cheese in her tummy to slow down the sugar, she'll be a crazy person...... I want to be the fun auntie, but she's with me and mom so much, I feel like I have to be a parent figure. __________________ Married since May 2010 to DT Mama to Zoe 8/1/13 Baby number two due May 17th 2015

07-01-2014, 08:51 AM	#4
Hermana Linda Administrator "air-mannah Leen-dah" it means Sister Linda in Spanish Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 51,848	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" That's a good reason not to make the drink. She could have the milk alone or maybe she will want the waffle later. Sent from my mobile device by Tapatalk __________________ My pages: Why Not Train A Child? and the FB Page as well as @WhyNotTrain on Twitter Read about how my husband was Pulled From The River By God

07-01-2014, 09:24 AM	#5
Little Forest Rose Garden Rich in girls. Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Perth hills, Australia Posts: 6,914	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" Maybe she is thirsty, or more thirsty than hungry? I don't understand why she could have the waffle and drink but not just the drink or the drink before the waffle. Mind you, I would not make the milk too sugary at any rate. The protein and fat in the milk slow down the sugar absorption in the bloodstream too. Do her parents have any such policy on her eating and drinking? Posted via Mobile Device

07-01-2014, 10:58 AM	#6
Dtswife Rose Bouquet Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wisconsin USA Posts: 814	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" Because the drink is special and she isn't allowed to have it all the time or before she has food of some kind. Yogurt, waffle, whatever, food before special drink. She has water available to her all the time in a sippy cup. I don't know what my sister's policy is. We don't really hang out together that much. She ended up eating the waffle. __________________ Married since May 2010 to DT Mama to Zoe 8/1/13 Baby number two due May 17th 2015

07-01-2014, 11:08 AM	#7
ArmsOfLove Rose Garden Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 79,607	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" I think there are two issues - do you give her the milk/"coffee" AND should she be able to understand. As to the first - totally your call and I think whatever you decide to do is fine If you decide to give it to her it's fine If you decide not to, it might give you a chance to reflect feelings and help her learn to name and own her feelings, or she might be fine and that's great too As to the second, she is too young to be expected to really understand, but it can be good to share your reasons very simply and matter of factly. Instead of choices I did a lot of "first X, then Y." So like "you can have your drink after you eat your waffle. Eat your waffle." (I consider these great opportunities to speak with words of logic so that as they develop pre-logic and then logic they start to understand what you've been doing and they already have the language ) but then I have to remember that even when they are copying the language that doesn't mean they have logic No matter how logical they sound, it comes in it's time __________________ Crystal "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time." Maya Angelou

07-01-2014, 11:25 AM	#8
Dtswife Rose Bouquet Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wisconsin USA Posts: 814	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" We did that. When your waffle is gone, I will make your coffee. . . Waffle, then coffee...... when your tummy is full of waffle, you can have pink coffee...... all interspersed by "NO! COFFEE NOW!" Followed by me: "I know. Pink coffee is so yummy. But waffle first." __________________ Married since May 2010 to DT Mama to Zoe 8/1/13 Baby number two due May 17th 2015 Last edited by Dtswife; 07-01-2014 at 11:47 AM.

07-01-2014, 11:44 AM	#9
Johns_Gal Rose Garden Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 8,764	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" When I do offer treats, my quota for nourishing food has already been met so I don't fret. Like eh, you ate an avocado and chicken... sure, you can have a sorbet. At that age though, no treats with qualifiers. Either the kid can have it right then or I don't even mention it. If she was accustomed to it, I would just do it and move on. Not my kid, not my problem. I'm not his/her parent and if that's how her family does it, I'm not going to change it up on a 2.5 year old. __________________ He is seven and she is days from turning two. I'm not sure how this happened.

07-01-2014, 11:44 AM	#10
ArmsOfLove Rose Garden Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 79,607	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" gotta love the wee ones contribution to those discussions I often had to remind myself that the best way to deal with them in those moments are the way I would deal with a drunk adult - can't reason with them, can't expect them to have logic, just tell them what we're doing and insist they do it (for example, pry keys out of their hand and stuff them into the backseat ). Glad she ate the waffle sounds like you handled it great __________________ Crystal "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time." Maya Angelou

07-01-2014, 11:49 AM	#11
Johns_Gal Rose Garden Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 8,764	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" Drunk adult. That is the most horribly perfect analogy for a cranky toddler. Just be quiet and here's a deceptively nourishing muffin. We're leaving. Where are mama's earplugs? __________________ He is seven and she is days from turning two. I'm not sure how this happened.

07-01-2014, 11:52 AM	#12
Dtswife Rose Bouquet Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wisconsin USA Posts: 814	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" She may not be my child, but I love her very much and when she is here, she is my problem and responsibility. It wasn't offered. She asked. I don't know for sure what her family does. I know brother-in-law doesn't care and gives her snickers for breakfast sometimes. Idk what my sister's at home policy is. She's here at the store 3 days a week. This is more like being at home for her than a fun visit to Grandma and aunt Chelse. I use her as a GBD test pilot. Lol, drunk person is a great description! Love it! __________________ Married since May 2010 to DT Mama to Zoe 8/1/13 Baby number two due May 17th 2015

07-01-2014, 12:13 PM	#13
ArmsOfLove Rose Garden Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 79,607	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" Sounds like she responds really well to your boundaries and I bet she feels really safe when she's with you One of the things I love about gentle discipline is the opportunity to give the children who are in my life - even those not mine - tools they can use to navigate the rest of their world. If I share with a child the idea of taking a break, or even just reflect and name their feelings, that is something that they can remember when they are back in their every day and something happens. It can show them there is another way than what they usually experience (whatever that is). I think it's empowering for them __________________ Crystal "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time." Maya Angelou

07-02-2014, 07:12 AM	#14
rjy9343 Rose Garden Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 10,090	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" You are in a strange position. You aren't quite the aunt, but not the quite the parent either. I am in that place with my niece and nephew. It is a very hard line to walk, but it does pay off in spades. My niece is nine and my nephew is eight, both children trust me and like to be around me. They believe me to be safe person and have chosen to let me be a part of their lives because I did a lot of what you are doing now. Verbal does not mean understanding. My daughter spoke in complete sentences before her second birthday, but that did not mean she grasped what she said. It was really frustrating because she sounded and reasoned like a five year old, but had the emotional maturity of a two year old. It is still irritating at times to treat her like she is her age because she sounds like she is in elementary school when she speaks. The child has not even reached kindergarten. __________________ Rita s IstJ Wife to my brilliant geek James iNtJ since 4/08 Mom to our angel boy Jay 5/08 our quirky miracle DD Ivy 6/10 mellow miracle DS Jacob 7/15 Often Please forgive my frequent typos Standing firmly on Team Lioness!!! Roar!!! I am ready for people to know I am a GCM find me on Facebook Last edited by rjy9343; 07-06-2014 at 07:20 PM.

07-02-2014, 10:07 AM	#15
OatsandBran11 Rosebud Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 120	Re: No waffle, no "coffee" Have you been around her pretty consistently when she was born? Other people's 2-year-olds always seemed older to me, but now that I have my own, I am more aware of her limitations. __________________ Wife for 5 years Mama to DD - age 2

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