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Unprepared for Parenting (Ezzos, Pearls, Etc.) *Public* Support and information for those affected by the Ezzos, the Pearls, and other punitive and adversarial methods of child-rearing.
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23. No posts harshly dissecting parenting moments of others since we desire to humbly cultivate a heart attitude of grace and not judgment towards other mamas. We all struggle at times as parents and have much to learn, and GCM's focus is to provide tools and information for each of us to parent more effectively. Posts voicing some frustration regarding choices made by others can be okay, but it needs to be within the overall context of seeking understanding or ideas for better responses in the future.

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Old 08-25-2020, 07:46 PM   #1
SewingGreenMama
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Default People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

I've not heard about it in years. But a mom in one of my Christian fb mom groups just mentioned she uses it and my jaw hit the floor.
Thank you for the Resources here. She mentioned it as a good resource to a mom of 4 struggling with a difficult sleeper.
I was able to quickly link to resources so she would know the dangers of that book.

I'm now looking for alternative resources for helping baby sleep.

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"If punishment were necessarily reformative, and able to cure us all of those 'sins we have a mind to,' why, the world would be a very good world;" -Charlotte Mason, Parents and Children pg. 172

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Old 08-25-2020, 08:04 PM   #2
Hermana Linda
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

Wow! I didn't think anyone was still using it either.

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Old 08-25-2020, 08:12 PM   #3
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

Elizabeth Pantley as an alternative resource.
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Old 08-25-2020, 08:14 PM   #4
SewingGreenMama
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

The mom needing help just admitted she used it with her others and said she was trying other things with this babe because he was not calming down and working himself into a mess.
I've honestly never had a difficult sleeper and have always bed shared. IDK what are good resources.

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---------- Post added at 11:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:13 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingBlueKiwi View Post
Elizabeth Pantley as an alternative resource.
Thank you!

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"Reflections like these lead one to spare the rod ... purely because it is not easy to find a punishment that does not defeat it's own ends." -Charlotte Mason Parents and Children pg. 171

"If punishment were necessarily reformative, and able to cure us all of those 'sins we have a mind to,' why, the world would be a very good world;" -Charlotte Mason, Parents and Children pg. 172

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Old 08-25-2020, 09:49 PM   #5
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

I've never had an easy sleeper and it's very important for her to know that it's NORMAL and OKAY. It's not easy, of course, but it doesn't mean she's doing something wrong. It is biologically normal for babies to wake to feed during the night.

A baby showing signs of discomfort or pain is another thing but sleep training isn't the answer for that, obviously.
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Old 08-26-2020, 05:00 AM   #6
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

This mom that you mention really needs help. It's one of the most dangerous sources that can find in my opinion. I think you should talk to her and explain it. Hope everything is going to be okay.
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Old 08-26-2020, 05:23 AM   #7
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatrice View Post
This mom that you mention really needs help. It's one of the most dangerous sources that can find in my opinion. I think you should talk to her and explain it. Hope everything is going to be okay.
She was alarmed by what I shared in my post about BW and the Ezzo's and said she would read the links.
I'm really saddened and disheartened that more of these women I've come to care for are stepping up admitting to using BW or a modified versions of CIO.
Praying for Grace and a loving tone to open hearts and minds.

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"Reflections like these lead one to spare the rod ... purely because it is not easy to find a punishment that does not defeat it's own ends." -Charlotte Mason Parents and Children pg. 171

"If punishment were necessarily reformative, and able to cure us all of those 'sins we have a mind to,' why, the world would be a very good world;" -Charlotte Mason, Parents and Children pg. 172

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Old 08-26-2020, 12:50 PM   #8
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

I had the world champion for worst sleeper. There is a reason I have five years between my children and even at ten and five, they wake up at night. I get the why behind it, she's desperate for sleep. I completely understand why she would even consider it.
That being said, I never did it. For Ivy, I took the side off of a crib and put it against my bed and I think we tied the legs to the bed, but it's been so long I can't remember. For Jacob, I put a bedrail on a very firm twin mattress and put it against my bed. Both of them would need to nurse frequently, but slept much better because they didn't have time to fully wake up and fell back asleep while nursing. I usually fell asleep pretty quickly afterwards and was much less tired.
Assuming her baby isn't dealing with colic, allergies, reflux or other medical issues, then her baby might just need to be reassured that everyone is still there and he or she is still safe. That's normal and baby will outgrow it.
I guess my point is to give you something a friend tried and liked. CIO isn't the answer, but it's a very socially acceptable thing to do, so here we are. Add in a the moral issues that BW and others assign sleeping through the night, then it's very hard not to do it.
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Old 08-26-2020, 01:14 PM   #9
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

Quote:
Originally Posted by rjy9343 View Post
I had the world champion for worst sleeper. There is a reason I have five years between my children and even at ten and five, they wake up at night. I get the why behind it, she's desperate for sleep. I completely understand why she would even consider it.

That being said, I never did it. For Ivy, I took the side off of a crib and put it against my bed and I think we tied the legs to the bed, but it's been so long I can't remember. For Jacob, I put a bedrail on a very firm twin mattress and put it against my bed. Both of them would need to nurse frequently, but slept much better because they didn't have time to fully wake up and fell back asleep while nursing. I usually fell asleep pretty quickly afterwards and was much less tired.

Assuming her baby isn't dealing with colic, allergies, reflux or other medical issues, then her baby might just need to be reassured that everyone is still there and he or she is still safe. That's normal and baby will outgrow it.

I guess my point is to give you something a friend tried and liked. CIO isn't the answer, but it's a very socially acceptable thing to do, so here we are. Add in a the moral issues that BW and others assign sleeping through the night, then it's very hard not to do it.
Yes, I mentioned bedsharing, I stepped back a bit because I didn't want her to feel like I was badgering her.

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"Reflections like these lead one to spare the rod ... purely because it is not easy to find a punishment that does not defeat it's own ends." -Charlotte Mason Parents and Children pg. 171

"If punishment were necessarily reformative, and able to cure us all of those 'sins we have a mind to,' why, the world would be a very good world;" -Charlotte Mason, Parents and Children pg. 172

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Old 08-26-2020, 01:28 PM   #10
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

I see babywise recommended a lot. Also I feel like bedsharing is under huge attack lately. When we started people thought it was weird. Now I hear more stuff like that it isnít safe and if you really love your baby you wonít do it. We still do it.
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Old 08-26-2020, 01:34 PM   #11
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerynne View Post
I see babywise recommended a lot. Also I feel like bedsharing is under huge attack lately. When we started people thought it was weird. Now I hear more stuff like that it isnít safe and if you really love your baby you wonít do it. We still do it.
Yes. It is under HEAVY attack.
It was a forbidden topic in one of my due date groups because it always caused an outright war.
Another one was better moderated so it was permitted with restrictions or the thread closed. Those who are against bed sharing are militant about it, which is why I'm always hesitant to say anything online, some insane people go real life, and most who think bedsharing is dangerous aren't calm about it.

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"Reflections like these lead one to spare the rod ... purely because it is not easy to find a punishment that does not defeat it's own ends." -Charlotte Mason Parents and Children pg. 171

"If punishment were necessarily reformative, and able to cure us all of those 'sins we have a mind to,' why, the world would be a very good world;" -Charlotte Mason, Parents and Children pg. 172

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Old 08-26-2020, 03:15 PM   #12
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

A bassinet next to the bed, a crib next to the bed, or a co-sleeper are all safe options for those who don't want to bed share.

I had a Snuggle Nest with my first and it kept me from going insane. I was so afraid of rolling on her, as she was my first. She would not stay asleep unless I was touching her. I went the first 3 days of her life without sleep. I sent my DH to the store and told him not to come back until he found one. (Mine looked different than this one but it's the general idea.)

When she got too big for it we bought an Arm's Reach Co-Sleeper. It can be used as a regular pack 'n play, too. I also used that with my second baby and our first was still in our bed when he was born.

This one looks good, too. https://www.amazon.com/RONBEI-Bassin...xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==
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Old 08-26-2020, 05:23 PM   #13
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soliloquy View Post
A bassinet next to the bed, a crib next to the bed, or a co-sleeper are all safe options for those who don't want to bed share.

I had a Snuggle Nest with my first and it kept me from going insane. I was so afraid of rolling on her, as she was my first. She would not stay asleep unless I was touching her. I went the first 3 days of her life without sleep. I sent my DH to the store and told him not to come back until he found one. (Mine looked different than this one but it's the general idea.)

When she got too big for it we bought an Arm's Reach Co-Sleeper. It can be used as a regular pack 'n play, too. I also used that with my second baby and our first was still in our bed when he was born.

This one looks good, too. https://www.amazon.com/RONBEI-Bassin...xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==
These are awesome, I'll let her know.

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"Reflections like these lead one to spare the rod ... purely because it is not easy to find a punishment that does not defeat it's own ends." -Charlotte Mason Parents and Children pg. 171

"If punishment were necessarily reformative, and able to cure us all of those 'sins we have a mind to,' why, the world would be a very good world;" -Charlotte Mason, Parents and Children pg. 172

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Old 08-26-2020, 06:59 PM   #14
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SewingGreenMama View Post
Yes. It is under HEAVY attack.
It was a forbidden topic in one of my due date groups because it always caused an outright war.
Another one was better moderated so it was permitted with restrictions or the thread closed. Those who are against bed sharing are militant about it, which is why I'm always hesitant to say anything online, some insane people go real life, and most who think bedsharing is dangerous aren't calm about it.

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I agree itís under attack. They were very vocal about baby being on his back in a crib or bassinet in the hospital this July when I had my fifth. It was also a big point of contention in a Pregnancy group I was in. So much so that for DS3ís first few days of life, I re-researched bedsharing like I had done with my first. I almost felt like I was being irresponsible though I did it with my other DC. I was reassured again when I saw risk factors of smoking in the house, mom being under the influence of drugs/alcohol and reminded that breastfeeding is actually protection for babies, helping to prevent death of infants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soliloquy View Post
A bassinet next to the bed, a crib next to the bed, or a co-sleeper are all safe options for those who don't want to bed share.

I had a Snuggle Nest with my first and it kept me from going insane. I was so afraid of rolling on her, as she was my first. She would not stay asleep unless I was touching her. I went the first 3 days of her life without sleep. I sent my DH to the store and told him not to come back until he found one. (Mine looked different than this one but it's the general idea.)

When she got too big for it we bought an Arm's Reach Co-Sleeper. It can be used as a regular pack 'n play, too. I also used that with my second baby and our first was still in our bed when he was born.

This one looks good, too. https://www.amazon.com/RONBEI-Bassin...xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==
I used a snuggle nest with DD1, also. And DH voluntarily left the bed for peace of mind.
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Old 08-27-2020, 10:12 AM   #15
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Default Re: People still use Babywise?! AKA: thank you for the resources!

I just want to second the books by Elizabeth Pantley. I am actually rereading "the no cry sleep solution" right now and am so encouraged by her gentle tone and the obvious sympathy she has. My library has this an ebook loan so that might be an option for that mom.
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