I need to say a few things about the idea of defiance

[Tandem mama]

Since this is in a public part of the forum-can I have dh read the op? We are struggling with how we view things as defiance.

[Heather Micaela]

Originally Posted by Tandem mama

Since this is in a public part of the forum-can I have dh read the op? We are struggling with how we view things as defiance.

anything public is fair game for all

[Tandem mama]

Originally Posted by Heather Micaela

anything public is fair game for all

That's what I thought but am still new and didn't want to break rules.

[wallflowermama]

[Domina]

Subbing.

Thanks Crystal, that was a really simple way of putting it. I really appreciate that. It certainly will make me think when it comes to the children and their defiance. I do have a question though, not sure whether this has already been discussed as I only your original post. What if the defiance is against doing something? Eg my daughter was adamant that she was not going to do her school work with me yesterday, I have no idea why but she was in a very cranky mood not wanting to do anything at all that I suggested. How do you deal with that? Do you as the parent ask why she is feeling that way, why she is not wanting to do school work? Sorry, but I am only just beginning on my journey as a grace based parent.

[ArmsOfLove]

Originally Posted by Molly

Thanks Crystal, that was a really simple way of putting it. I really appreciate that. It certainly will make me think when it comes to the children and their defiance. I do have a question though, not sure whether this has already been discussed as I only your original post. What if the defiance is against doing something? Eg my daughter was adamant that she was not going to do her school work with me yesterday, I have no idea why but she was in a very cranky mood not wanting to do anything at all that I suggested. How do you deal with that? Do you as the parent ask why she is feeling that way, why she is not wanting to do school work? Sorry, but I am only just beginning on my journey as a grace based parent.

I can answer briefly but I'm sure a new post started with this situation will get lots of different ideas for you. Usually I evaluate the situation using the HALT (I know some have added other letters that are great but I can never remember them 3). This is basically to stop and ask if the child is Hungry, Anxious, Lonely or Tired. Add in whatever other things are usually a trigger for your child and most times it's pretty easy to figure out what is impacting them. Take some time to address the emotion or underlying issue and then you will gain cooperation (or remove the reason it wasn't coming). You can ask with an older child but not all children are able to know and express their feelings until they are taught. My guess is she was either hungry or tired or something negative happened at school she hadn't yet processed

I will hunt out that other thread. But thank you, that so makes sense.

[GraemesMomma]

Way old thread that I want to sub Great stuff here.

[filmgirl2911]

me, too

thanks for bumping it so I could find it

[SewingGreenMama]

Originally Posted by akmyilee

Thanks, this has been coming up a lot for me lately because they just did a Dobson study at our church.........I really needed that clarification and reminder.

in the instance of the spilled cereal..........I would have thought the examples that you gave would not have been defiance either. BUT what about when I say "your cereal bowl goes on the table" and the child (now I am not meaning a toddler, like my 4yo) picks up the bowl and dumps it out on the floor..........what then? I mean I would still give them a towel and would expect him to help clean it up, but should that "attitude" (I hate to use that word) be dealt with?

I've discovered that when my son deliberately disobeyed me before he could talk it was to make sure the rule still applied, that it was true with both hands, etc, not defiance, just exploring the boundaries to fully understand them, or such a total single minded NEED to know, touch, explore the particular thing they are unable to stop and need serious distraction.
Now that he is older when he is defient I have discovered it is usually because I've either not been consistent or I have treated him unjustly and he is defiant and uncooperative out of hurt and anger, that is MY fault, it doesn't excuse him but it does help me understand, then I step forward and apologize, re-establish boundaries etc and almost immediately he is a different child. I'm modeling correct behavior and addressed the true situation, his defiance was a helpless, hurt, and/or confused child's reaction to confusing boundaries/authority and/or unjustness.

[katiekind]

I've discovered that when my son deliberately disobeyed me before he could talk it was to make sure the rule still applied, that it was true with both hands, etc

My scientific/engineer/techie-minded son was like that as a tiny tot.

[Tandem mama]

For my oldest, I've noticed "defiance" during stress times and age changes. I think the age changes may be a hormonal shift. When she feels out of control, she becomes oppositional and fights me for control over everything going on in our home. We keep our boundaries but make space for extra choice making for her during those times. We try to allow her to feel more in control without becoming permissive and losing all boundaries. We reasses some of them to make sure they're necessary. Mostly we just wait the phase out.

[SewingGreenMama]

Originally Posted by katiekind

My scientific/engineer/techie-minded son was like that as a tiny tot.

Good to know my techno kid isn't the only one.

[Whirlwind]

Thanks, that is a very helpful way of looking at things (that kids may be testing the rule for greater understanding, rather than testing a parent for "weakness"). I'll try to tuck that info in the back of my mind somewhere for any future frustrating moments.